MINUTES RIS COMMON ISSUES MEETING

MINUTES RIS COMMON ISSUES MEETING Date 18th November 2009 Location Duration Participants via donau Österreichische Wasserstraßen-Gesellschaft mbh Donau-City-Straße 1 A-1220 Wien 9.00 17.00 hs DG-TREN: represented by Astrid Schlewing (Project Officer) RIS Expert Groups members RISING representatives IRIS II representatives PLATINA representatives RIS The Netherlands representative RIS Flanders Represetnatives RIS Scheldt representatives CIF representative Newada Representatives Author minutes See attendace list in attachement Nora Schmorak 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 1

A.1 Welcome and introduction Cas Willems welcomes the meeting participants and thanks them for their presence. The meeting aims at discussing the common issues of RIS Expert Groups and RIS European projects and at defining coordination actions. The agenda for the morning sessions has been set up as follows: 1. Objectives and status of RISING (Arne Gehlhaar/Frank Arendt) 2. Objectives and status of IRIS II (Mario Sattler/ Mario Kaufmann) 3. Objectives and status of PLATINA SWP2.3 and SWP5.2 (Andreas Baeck/Cas Willems). 4. TEN-T projects in the Netherlands (Ivo ten Broeke) 5. TEN-T project SIF (Alaric Blakeway) 6. TEN-T project RIS in Flanders (Raes, Vermeir and Torfs) 7. Objectives and status RIS Expert Group Inland ECDIS (Bernd Birklhuber) 8. Objectives and status RIS Expert Group Inland ECDIS Vessel Tracking and Tracing (Lea Kuiters) 9. Objectives and status RIS Expert Group Notices to Skippers (Peter Kluytenaar) 10.Objectives and status RIS Expert Group Electronic Reporting International (Jos van Splunder) 11.Conclusions of the morning session and common issues to be addressed in the afternoon workshops A.2 Rising by Arne Gelhaar Mr Gelhaar presents the objectives and status of Rising. See ppt-file with the complete presentation. Mr. de Lijster remarks that there is an ERI voyage planner to be used as basis. Mr. Persoons replies that all ERI standards and protocols will be used by Rising as a basis to build further upon. Mr. Gelhaar explains that AIS positioning is also needed for voyage planning. 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 2

A.3 IRIS II by Mario Kaufman Mr Kaufman presents the status and objectives of IRIS Europe II. See the presentation in pptfile. Mr Ruzic underlines the need of dealing with different references of water-level data while modelling within Sub-activity 1.2 Mr Baeck asks for discussion in the afternoon concerning RIS data exchange among RIS providers. Data exchange agreements are relatively easy to achieve but therefore the purposes have to be made explicit. A.4 PLATINA by Cas Willems Mr Willems presents the status and objectives of PLATINA SWP5.2 and 2.3. See the presentation in ppt-file. During this presentation Mrs Schmorak launches the RIS Community Portal to the audience, the reaction on the community portal were positive.. A.5 TEN-T projects in the Netherlands by Ivo ten Broeke Mr ten Broeke presents the status and objectives of the TEN-T projects in the Netherlands. See the presentation in ppt-file. Mrs Kuiters urges for cooperation between the TEN-T projects in the Netherlands and the three pilots of LIVRA. A.6 SIF by Alaric Blakeway. Mr Blakeway presents the status and objectives of SIF I France (TEN-T project). See the presentation in ppt-file. Mrs Javor asks if the SIF data is going to be available. Mr Balkeway replies that users will be able to access their own data through the website. A.7 RIS in Flanders by Raes and Vermeir Mr Raes and Mr Vermeir present the status and objectives of the TEN-T project, RIS in Flanders. See the presentation in ppt-file. A.8 Inland ECDIS by Bernd Birklhuber Mr Birklhuber presents the status and objectives of the RIS Expert Group Inland ECDIS. See the presentation in ppt-file. 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 3

A.9 VTT by Lea Kuiters Mrs Kuiters presents the status and objectives of the RIS Expert Group Vessel Tracking and Tracing. See the presentation in ppt-file. A.10 NtS by Peter Kluytenaar (no ppt available) The main issues of the presentation follow here below: Goal of NtS Expert Group: To extend and mantain standards for NtS such as: - data standards - technical standards - reference standards - communication standards and interface specifications How do we do it? We do it by mean of collaboration between technical experts, operational experts, industry, users. Working together by consensus on a common goal and respect for each other interests. It is hereby important to have all the stakeholders (including commissions) around the table. Why do we do it? - striving for a single window of information for the skipper to navigate safely and efficient - have this information machine readable to allow voyage planning - address the language issue Important issues for today: Inland ECDIS - Unclear relationship Inland ENC and RIS Index - ISRS codes in all relevant objects - similar objects and attribute naming ERI - Terminal codes versus RIS index needs to be consolidated/clarify responsability. - ERI voyage plan (FIS implementation) - safety messages vs list of calamities and dangers 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 4

NtS, ERI and VTT - vessel types NtS, VTT and Inland ECDIS - strive for agreement on when AIS message, NtS and/or IENC update (need experience) Status RIS index - Not clearly defined in RIS Directive - Not part of any standard - No need of new expert group Support from EU projects - very much appreciated - some matters need sustainable solutions Other issues: - need to respond fast to those issues in standard hindering implementation - stability of standards does not mean that we dont need manteinance - having to wait 2 years for corrections cost memeber states money A.11 Conclusion of the morning session Mr Willems concludes that it is clear that so much has been done in the past ten years within the RIS community. The challenge now is to tackle implementation issues based on experiences. He calls the project representatives to bring up those issues to the expert groups. He also asks the partcipants not to start up new things before implementation is completed, users, industry and authorities are in the process of implementation and this requires a stable situation. He stresses the fact that the RIS enviroment is many steps further ahead from other sectors like road transportation. Mr van de Laar compliments the expert groups for their work along the years. What they achieved is very important for the IWT sector. He stresses the need of structural integration of the branche into the expert groups and he offers the input from the users. Mr Birklhuber invites the branch to participate in the expert groups meetings. Mr ten Broeke states that legal barriers for data exchange are a problem for implementation. RIS implementation should be an European concern instead of an only national one. Mr van de Laar warns the expert groups for too unclear and extensive clarification documents. Avoid a clarification driven development of standards! Mrs Kuiters explains that clarification documents are needed in the transition time between two standard versions. 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 5

Mr Smeets asks the influence of the INSPIRE. Directive on the work in the ECDIS and NtS environement. Mr Willems states that discussions on the INSPIRE directive and his effects on the RIS standards is needed as soon as the details of the directives are clear.. PLATINA will do the facts finding about the common issues with INSPIRE towards further discussion with the expert groups. Mr Willems defines the agenda for the afternoon workshops: - Need for standards amendments and extensions by Jan Tore Pedersen - Quality of Information Services (QoIS) by Jos van Splunder - Reference Data and RIS index by Cas Willems - TAA International data exchange by Mario Kaufman - Hull database by Andreas Baeck - Legal barriers by Ivo ten Broeke A.12 Presentation by Johan Torfs Mr Torfs presents issues related to the TEN-T projects RIS in Flanders. See the presentation in ppt-file. A.13 Afternoon workshops Need for standards amendments and extensions by Jan Tore Pedersen See the presentation in ppt file Mr van de Laar doesn t agree on the statement about the need of increasing reliability. Transparency should be increased but IWT is very reliable in comparison to other modes. Mr Pedersen emphasises in his reply that all the parties involved in RIS should communicate with each other by mean of reliable information. He adds that the logistics world is not aware of the RIS community when looking for solutions in the field of communication. Please, fit the RIS standards to the users needs. Mr. Pedersen stresses the need of communication with logistic stakeholders. The goal must be door-to-door transport, utilizing IWT as part of the chain on such an efficient and attractive way that it shifts freight transport out of the road. The presented approach is strongly supportef by the EC with the efreight initiative. Mr. ten Broeke asks Rising to get in-depth information about RIS and the standards before communicating with logistics. FIS NL is for instance aiming at the provision of information for logistics parties. 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 6

Lea Kuiters adds to the presentation of Mr Pederson that the RIS architecture integrates IWT with other modes through the existing standards. Please, let s complement each other! The RIS architecture as well as the Maritime architecture are based on the same concept. Mr. Pederson supports complementation and cooperation. We need to define a package doing the basics for logistics and keep it simple. Mrs. Schlewing underlines the need of reinforcing the logistic services of RIS. This is the aim of RISING. Mr. de Lijster urges for close cooperation between Rising, the RIS community and the logistic partners, finding common solutions but not dictating solutions. Otherwise we will end up with nothing. Mr. Kluytenaar remarks that there are a lot of companies making money out of the sector inefficiency, making very difficult to realize enhancements. AP RISING. Coordination meeting with IRIS II, ERI and the sector represented by BTB IRIS II activity on AIS by Mario Kaufman See the presentation in ppt-file. Mr. ten Broeke stresses the important of using AIS for safety purposes as primarily meant to be and not for communication. First define the message based on the needs and after that talk about the communication mean (not the other way around). Mr. Willems proposes to define the basic characteristics of information services and link the categories to communication channels and RIS tools. The Input paper will be written by IRIS Europe II Mr. Kluytenaar stresses the need to concentrate on correcting and not defining new things. Mr. Polschinsky asks not to overload skipper with requirements of exchanging data. Define minimum sets for each service. Otherwise it will be very difficult to implement. AP IRIS II. Input paper about the characteristics of the information services and the link to information channels and RIS technology for discussion with the EGs first and then on international level. Quality of Information Services (QoIS) by Jos van Splunder. Mr. van Splunder's presentation is available as ppt file. Mr Kluytenaar remarks the relevance of looking at the legal aspects. Which are the accents on quality of the regulations including jurisprudence. There are cases of accidents when the judges rule based on quality of information. Mr Willems remarks that there is a Inland ECDIS meeting planned for December 4th 2009 on QoIS. Also Newada has an activity on QoS for ENCs. Rising also has related activities. All these activities should be combined. 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 7

AP IRIS II will take the lead for coordination of actions on QoIS and invites for their meeting on 4 December EG Inland ECDIS, RISING and NEWADA. Ris index and reference data Cas Willems presents the actions of PLATINA towards clear and unambiguous definition of RIS index and other RIS reference data. See his presentation in the ppt-file. Cas Willems will send the PLATINA reports to the delegations. Please provide your input and propose solutions. PLATINA will discuss with EG chairs and in February 2010 a workshop will be organised towards final solution. AP PLATINA: Workshop on RIS index and reference data on February 2nd 2010 in Rotterdam. National experts and the industry will be invited to the workshop. Expert Groups members will together with Platina take the lead in this process.. Iris II TAA international data exchange Mario Kaufman s presentation about the needed coordination and cooperation actions is available as ppt-file. Mr. de Lijster asks how will IRIS II ensure cooperation for data exchange. Mr. Kaufman replies that it will be handled on case by case basis. In principle, the existing standards will be taken as basis. Mr Gelhaar underlines the fact that RISING is not trying to impose new standards to the RIS community. The standard and the logistics needs have to come together. Hull database Platina deliverable Hull database is under the leading of Andreas Baeck. He presented the objectives, data processed and the planned steps. See ppt file with the full presentation. Legal barriers Mr. ten Broeke remarks that there are lot of developments towards data exchange but there are also lot of legal barriers for this exchange. He states that we can agree on lots of good things for RIS in the sector but let s be aware of the barriers and find a way to tackle this barriers. The best thing to do is make an amendment to the ris directive or to have another directive making exchange of data possible without tackling the barriers on case basis. Cas Willems thinks that in order to have a solution on short notice - we have to come to a agreement on member state level without Europe in the middle. Mr. Baeck agrees and states that a permanent solution through the EC would take at least 3 years so other solutions are needed for short term. 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 8

Mr Ten Broeke would rather like to see a more general and permanent solution. It needs to be tackled during the implementation because it is hindering it. Mr van Laar shares the observation and proposes to try to come to an agreement together with EBU. A.14 Next meeting Next year on the same period of the year. Action point Leader Participants When 1. Coordination meeting on logistic services. Jan Tore Pedersen (RISING, e- freight) IRIS II, ERI and DTB ASAP 2.. Input paper on RIS services versus RIS communication tools Mario Kaufman Expert Groups, River Commissions ASAP (IRIS II) 3. RIS index and other reference data Tightening definitions and solving open topics Cas Willems (PLATINA) National representatives, Industry, EG s and Platina February 2 nd 2010 4. Definition of quality (action within QoIS activities). Mario Kaufman (IRIS II) Representatives of Newada, Rising, IRIS II and IECDIS will meet on December 4th 2009. 5. Fact finding INSPIRE Cas Willems Input to EG Janaury 2009 2009-11-18_PLATINA _SWP5 2_minutes_common issues meeting_v0.1.doc Page 9